Ep. 178: The Bipolar Side of Me Pt. 2

Kourtney Cromwell:
Welcome to The indoubt Podcast where we explore the challenging topics that young adults often face. Each week we talk with guest who help answer questions of faith, life, and culture, connecting them to our daily experiences and God’s Word. For more info on indoubt, visit indoubt.ca or indoubt.com.

Kourtney Cromwell:
Hey everyone and thanks for joining us today on this episode of indoubt. My name is Kourtney and I’m the indoubt coordinator. I’m so happy to have you listening. For today’s episode, Ryan is joined again by our very special guest, Julie Kraft. Join Ryan and Julie as they further discuss her journey with mental illness and how she decided to take the leap of sharing her story on social media. When Julie was diagnosed with bipolar 2 disorder, her life was flipped upside down. After taking time to grasp her new reality, Julie has learned to accept her diagnosis and take it in stride. She allows God to use her journey as an encouragement. Mental health is a topic that none of us are exempt from. Whether it’s your own personal journey with mental health or it’s someone you know. We all understand the severity of a diagnosis. It’s Julie’s hope that God will use her story to change lives. We invite you to join us and be encouraged by Julie’s story.

Ryan McCurdy:
All right, well, I’m excited today because I have with me a new friend and her name is Julie Kraft and Julie is an author and mental health advocate and she’s from near my hometown. She’s from Vancouver. Julie, thanks so much for being here.

Julie Kraft:
Hi. I’m thrilled to be here. It’s such an honor and a privilege to have this opportunity to share a little bit of my mental health journey and my faith and how it’s all intertwined, so I’m grateful, thrilled, excited.

Ryan McCurdy:
Cool. Why don’t we start with that? Why don’t we start with some of your journey and some of your experience with your own mental health and walking through that, discovering that, some of that and how God has been with you in the midst of it and how you got to where you are now?

Julie Kraft:
Okay. How long do we have? A year.

Ryan McCurdy:
Yeah, we could take some time.

Julie Kraft:
Okay, a quick overview. I’m a pastor’s kid, so that meant I pretty much was born in the front row of the church. I spent every Sunday in church and I really did feel like I grew up in a fishbowl. I spent my childhood moving around small towns. Everybody knew who we were, even where we lived. I really felt that pressure to always be that perfect little kid. Then when I was 10, my parents pulled the rug out from under me and we moved from a small town in Ontario, Canada to Vancouver. I’m thrilled despite moving around the world a little bit since that move at 10 years old, I’m now back in Vancouver living with my family. I’m married to a very patient man. We’ve been together 23 years and I’m also a mom. I have three daughters and I have bipolar 2 disorder. I wasn’t diagnosed until 36 years old and so the journey leading up to that, a lot of hurt and heartache and chaos. Then it’s been nine years since my diagnosis. It’s been quite a journey since then. Ups and downs, but so many amazing surprises along the way.
About four years after my diagnosis is when I really decided that I wanted to come forward and start to share my story. I wanted to put a new face of bipolar into the world. When I was first diagnosed, all I found were negative images, stereotypes. Everything the world was shouting at me was that, you know, I would be backed away from and feared and my life wasn’t going to go anywhere. My marriage was going to fall apart. My kids would hate me for the rest of my life. I didn’t feel like I fit any of those stereotypes. I thought, if I can take a deep breath and be brave and bold and come forward and start to share, then maybe just maybe I could be a tiny part of changing perceptions of bipolar. I wrote my memoir, which still surprises me. That was one of the hardest things I’ve ever done. Now I’m explosively passionate about sharing my journey, whether it’s on social media or stages or street corners. Any opportunity I have to share, I’ll take it, so I’m grateful for this chance.

Ryan McCurdy:
What was it like when at 36 years old, I guess you went to the doctor or psychologist or psychiatrist or something and they gave you this diagnosis? What was that like?

Julie Kraft:
It was terrifying. I was shocked, mortified, embarrassed. I had a lot of pride. I’m a perfectionist. I want it to be perfect. Having bipolar disorder was going to throw a major kink into those plans. Immediately, all the things I’d ever seen, you know, interviews with celebrities running off the rails, tiger blood and bi-winning or another celebrity. I don’t want to name names, but it seems like the media just loves to jump on those extremes, which are the extremes because the bipolar spectrum is so vast. I immediately was seeing all those images of unfortunately individuals that might not be treated or might not be managing their illness. I was terrified that I would be associated with all of those if I were to come forward. I would say for the first four years I was convinced I’d need to keep my diagnosis under wraps. I self-stigmatized, I assumed people were going to think the worst, back away. I wouldn’t be allowed to volunteer at the school. The church wouldn’t allow me to be a vacation Bible school volunteer, you know, and what would my fellow Christians think. Here’s this pastor’s kid struggling and bipolar disorder and how does that fit? I hid behind a giant smile and a mask for four years before there was a very defining moment actually that happened.

Ryan McCurdy:
What was it?

Julie Kraft:
All right.

Ryan McCurdy:
If we can go there. Can we go there?

Julie Kraft:
We can go there. Actually, at the time I was living in Germany. I was starting to make peace with my diagnosis. It’s so crazy or not so crazy to look back because the opportunity to move abroad for three years came along just a few months after my diagnosis. I now know in hindsight, of course, that it was all God’s plan and he knew that I needed time and space to take a deep breath and get perspective and clarity and just wrap my brain around my diagnosis. I was doing that, I was healing and then I actually applied for life insurance. There was a question on the questionnaire. I don’t understand a lot of German still after three years. It’s a tough language, but I love that country. It said psyche. I now know the question was asking me if I had any psychological issues. Of course I lied, so you have a liar on air today.

Ryan McCurdy:
There you go.

Julie Kraft:
I just said, you know, that’s not a big deal. I put no, and my conscience caught up with me that evening and so the next morning I sent an email to the agent and said, you know, I might have bipolar disorder. I’m on some medication. I’m not sure if this affects my coverage. Happy face, happy face, completely inappropriate email. He called me. Here I was, I just admitted to a total stranger that I have bipolar. He called me up and he said, you’re not eligible and it’s because people with bipolar are the ones that drive into brick walls at full speed. I felt like I had been punched in the gut. I started to cry. I wanted to end the call. I wanted to try to defend myself and everyone else with bipolar. That was what it took. That was the moment that I said, you know what? Let’s thank the insurance agent. He’s responsible for all of this.
I just said I need to do something and had no idea the journey that it would take me on but I just thought, you know what? I have to do this. I just started to write and journal. I didn’t know it would turn into a book or a video on social media, but I just took that first step and started to write with the hopes of somehow changing perceptions, giving someone even the smallest glimmer of hope. Because when I was diagnosed, all I needed to find was one picture, one story, someone that seemed to be living a happy, fulfilling normal life and I didn’t find one. My greatest hope now with me sharing is that if there’s someone newly diagnosed looking for even the faintest glimmer of hope that this is going to be okay, it’s all good, then that’s amazing. That’s why I’m sharing. That was it. That was the moment.

Ryan McCurdy:
That’s intense. First of all, who says that?

Julie Kraft:
It’s so intense. He did.

Ryan McCurdy:
My goodness. It’s so funny, like not funny ha ha but the irony of it all is that what this guy intended to be harmful was the very thing that would made you think, you know what? I’m going to make some good out of this situation.

Julie Kraft:
Yeah, sorry.

Ryan McCurdy:
I’m going to help try and make a difference in the world.

Julie Kraft:
Yeah, and the other thing I’ve now come to learn is I think in that moment he wasn’t being malicious. I don’t even think he realized what he was saying. I think he was going off stereotypes that he had seen. In the past few years I’ve really had to show grace to a lot of people and just realize people sometimes just don’t understand, especially in Vancouver. Our weather can be, I’ll use the word unpredictable, but two times this year I’ve been in a restaurant and the waiter has been making chitchat and you know, the weather is so bipolar. I’m like, I know in that moment he’s not meaning to hurt or offend me. Before I was diagnosed, I probably would have said it too. Of course, I did take that opportunity to pull him aside and just say, “Hey, you know what? I know you meant nothing bad by it, but I just need to let you know I have bipolar and it can represent so much pain and hurt. It’s not something to use lightly.” I mean, the waiter just looked at me, tears in his eyes and just apologized.
I think it’s so important for those of us living with mental health struggles, if we do hear a comment or a remark to just remember that I think it’s up to us to maybe take those opportunities to explain. I think that’s the other reason I’m so passionate about advocating. I’m kind of the only one that can give that inside scoop and let you hop into my brain for an hour or for the time that I’m able to speak at an event. I can’t really complain about stigma unless I’m willing to come forward and do something about it. That’s another huge motivating factor. I see the power that I can have to change those perceptions by putting a human face to the disorder and explaining why a comment like that might be a little bit hurtful. Then of course the brick wall. I mean, that’s the worst. I’ve had some other ones come along. Something that could have crushed me and kept me silent forever turned out. I mean, and I think that was part of God’s plan too, which just blows me away every minute of every day how God is in all the details.

Ryan McCurdy:
That’s cool. How did that come to pass? You had that encounter in Germany with the insurance agent and then you come to this conclusion, okay, I’m going to make something good out of my life based on, I’m going to stick it to this guy and say, hey man, well let me show you. Like, let me show you how many people I can help. Then you start helping people. What was that process like? Now, how have you been? Essentially the question is, how have you been helping advocate? In what ways have you been able to advocate or speak at events and what’s that been like? What’s the response been like?

Julie Kraft:
It’s just been amazing. It blows my mind. After that comment, I basically hung up the phone. I really did start to write. Germany gave me some free time. I wasn’t working over there, I wasn’t speaking the language. I think God gave me that time and I think his plan was to put that spark in me. I wrote and throughout my hypomanic episodes I wrote for days on end and I also, I can get easily distracted. Another creative avenue I took was I started to film my journey. I took out a Nikon and I got an ironing board and a stack of books, no joke. When my kids were at school, I just started filming. I didn’t even know what I was going to do with the footage, but little did I know it would become a video that I would post on social media and it would become the way that I actually let the people in my life know, including my parents and my in-laws. That was a terrifying moment but I posted the video, almost threw up in the keyboard. My husband warned me, you know, the trolls and the haters are coming so just be braced for it.
I can honestly say that the feedback was 99.9% love and compassion and empathy and then a private message, “Me too.” Then another one, “You know, my mom is bipolar and I’ve never told anyone.” The biggest, most incredible response though came from my fellow Christians because I was so convinced that if I ever came forward as a Christian that had been struggling and that now was diagnosed that they would shun me or judge my faith or lack of faith. Some of the comments that came in there, there are a few that really stick out in my mind. I’d love to share them just because they were so powerful and that’s how God knew he could get through to me and he used people. I think God send us his love and his messages in so many different ways. For me it was the people around me. One of the comments that came in, here we go, “Just watched your video. It has been my prayer that you would find balance, peace and rest while maintaining that spark that makes you special. I believe God has answered that prayer. I am so happy for you. I also wanted to say from a Christian perspective that God used the highs for his glory. I am so sorry for the lows that must have followed, but he enabled you to bear the weight of those.”
I mean, I never thought of it before that my hypomanic episodes because I volunteered at my kid’s school and I did have these amazing ideas for events and just this energy. You know, hypomania is always viewed in a negative light. For my fellow Christian to write and say, “You know what, God actually used you and that energy and part of your disorder for his glory.” I never thought of that before and unless she had written that to me, I never would have gained that perspective. Just a few others. “Thank you for your courage to be transparent. Jesus surely smiles.” I was like, Jesus surely smiles at the journey that I’ve been on when there was so much hurt and pain in my past and things that I carried shame over. You know, the way I treated my children. Another one, “May God continue to protect and guide you.” Another one. “Thank you for sharing. God never wastes a hurt. Your story will be powerfully used, I am sure.” Then they also put a comment about a song I had in the video that they loved it. That was the beginning of the restoring of my faith in all of this. The journey since has been mind-blowing.
I think God is a God that blows our minds all the time. Opportunity, someone saw my video and then reached out for an interview and every time I’m terrified, I’m insecure, I have my doubts but I say yes. I love Bob Goff. He has a quote, I included it in my book, and the quote is, “I used to think I had to be special for God to use me and now I know I only need to say yes.” My book is a yes, and my video was a yes. Being here today is a yes and the door is open. I freak out a little and then I say yes and I trust God. Then I just say, you know what? At the end of the day too, it’s not me. It’s all God. I have to trust that he’s given me everything that I need to do what he’s meant for me to do. That’s a snippet of my advocacy and so excited for the future. I know the ups and downs are going to come. Bipolar, there’s no cure. Recovery is not linear.
In the fall, I was down and I was having a hard time and now I’d say I’m definitely in a hypomanic phase which is not scary and not negative because I’ve learned how to manage it. I know that I need to be really diligent and responsible and find balance. It’s a responsibility that I don’t take lightly. If I post on social media, I want to make sure that it’s intentional and meaningful and not just a random selfie or my lunch. I just want to be so careful, but I’m so excited and you know, who knows? Who knows? God knows, but I’ll just one day at a time and see where it goes.

Ryan McCurdy:
What I find so interesting about your story and thanks for sharing. I think it’s beautiful just how God has worked in your life and I think it’s also beautiful how you can identify that it’s God working in your life. I think so often it’s like we go through hard times and some people with different challenges, whether it’s mental health or family or pain or grief. Some stuff is momentary and sometimes challenges are lifelong. Ultimately, we all face struggles and suffering but not all of us recognize that God is in it with us. That’s what I appreciate about your story is that you’re like, you know, maybe there’s times in the moment you’re like, Oh God, like this is so brutal. Where are you? But then at the same time, like now you’re looking back, you’re like, oh yeah, he was there and I know he was there because I know God is a trustworthy God. I think that’s something that I really appreciate. Anyways, I’m just saying I’m encouraged by that because I see that in your story.

Julie Kraft:
– and the Bible. I don’t know why I didn’t open my Bible more when I was struggling as a teenager and you know, a new mom and a newlywed and trying to navigate my struggles. I’ll admit I didn’t turn to God. I turned to the world and I relied on my own strength. Quite honestly, even in the past few weeks, I feel like God is just showing up and, my goodness, the Bible is jam-packed with promises and practical advice and verses to carry us through. God promises, I’m either going to calm you through the storm or I’m going to calm the storm, but I’m there no matter what. There’s a song, I love it. You know, sometimes he calms the storm with a whisper, peace be still or sometimes he calms his child. I’ve experienced both of those spectrums, but there are so many key verses too that, you know what, I have them written out. They’re on my mirror.
Before my day gets crazy with getting kids off to school, I try my best, I grab my coffee first, but then I try to just center myself. Read through a few key verses and they set the stage and calm me to get through the day. I just started doing that. I mean, I wish I could say as a pastor’s kid, I’ve done it, I’ve done it. I can memorize the scriptures, but I have them written out in front of me today because you know. That was another thing. I’m like, me on this podcast. I am not this big theologian and I don’t know my Bible as well as I should, but it’s okay. I just have to trust that all I have to do is show up and God’s going to do the rest.

Ryan McCurdy:
Now, when you said sharing your story, that four year gap before your diagnosis and then really like sharing that live video. You had mentioned that some of the fear was with fellow Christians. Would you say that was probably some of your biggest fear of what the reaction from other Christians was going to be? The question to follow that is, and maybe it’s more of an observation, it’s like, wow, as followers of Jesus we need to be the most gracious, loving, compassionate, like who’s been forgiven much will forgive… If we recognize what we’ve been forgiven for in Christ, when we meet somebody who’s different than us, that should demand some compassion and some understanding. I’m curious like that maybe expectation that you are going to receive backlash from fellow Christians and then receiving the opposite. That must’ve been-

Julie Kraft:
It blows me away. It blows me away. First off, as a pastor’s kid growing up in the spotlight and all the little old church ladies, I just felt like I could never be myself if I was having a down day. I now realized too, I grew up in a house with my mom and my dad saying yes all the time to everything. I didn’t even learn how to set boundaries. I thought saying no meant I was selfish or not giving. All of that I now know formed me into a teenager that didn’t know how to say no and was insecure. Of course, that carried on on a Sunday morning. I did, I questioned my faith and no one was talking about mental health outside at my school, my parents never talked about it. I surely didn’t hear a pastor upfront preaching a sermon about depression or anxiety. It was just the Bible verses and the songs and we just expected that that sort of would cover it all and cure it all. Through my teen years, when I started to struggle and I started to stress out about where was I going to sit in church.
When the pastor says, get up, turn around and greet the people around you, where’s the trap door. The communion plate, what if I spill the little cup and how big of a piece of bread should I take? All those things, all those worries were in my head on a Sunday morning. I now realize that was preventing me from even being able to focus or listen to the sermon. I did, I felt embarrassed and ashamed. Then when all of that was given a name, bipolar disorder, I did, I had a crisis of faith and I had to go back to the basics and ask myself, “Okay, do I believe in God? If I do, why? What does he say about me?” Then that’s when I really started to dig into the Bible. I think churches are starting to open up and talk about it. A lot of it too it was self-stigmatizing. I never gave the church or the people in the church the chance to shower me with God’s love and be his hands and his feet. Whether it was to bring me a meal or tell me that I was loved and accepted with all my quirks
It’s still a process but I had the opportunity to share my journey in a church and was just, I never felt so safe in my life. I think slowly, slowly, I think as people open up, they feel the freedom to open up. It’s this domino effect. I won’t steal the quote. I know it’s from someone much wiser than me, but I think Brené Brown says vulnerability breeds vulnerability. I think when you are willing to open up and share a part of yourself that is so personal, other people are given that same freedom. We all discover, you know what, Christians struggle too, we’re human and we’re in the world and everybody’s got something. It’s beautiful. It brings tears to my eyes day after day. I’ve come to this place now, I’m not ashamed. I cling to the Bible and I know that this is God’s plan and purpose for my life. I actually wouldn’t take a pill if there was one to cure bipolar and that shocks a lot of people, but I’ve now seen God work and give me so much peace in the process of this whole journey.

Ryan McCurdy:
I think that’s a beautiful picture. We’re going to continue this conversation, but thanks so much for being here and thanks so much for sharing.

Julie Kraft:
Thank you for having me.

Kourtney Cromwell:
Thanks so much for joining us on this episode of indoubt. We hope that Julie’s story has not only encouraged you but open your eyes a little bit more around the subject of mental health. By sharing her personal journey surrounding mental health, Julie is hoping to open up the doors of conversation, encouraging people to keep talking about mental health, which will lead to more understanding on the subject. You can find Julie on Facebook and Instagram @julie.kraft.author where she shares even more about her journey with bipolar 2 disorder. Julie has also written a personal memoir titled, The Other Side of Me. If you’d like to get a copy, you can head over to her website at www.juliekraft.com. We want to thank Julie for joining us on this episode of indoubt. She’s experienced the crash or break of struggling with the highs and lows of her diagnosis.

By explaining bipolar disorder, Julie has helped open up all of our eyes to what the disorder actually is and how we can learn to better respect the boundaries of other people, especially those suffering with mental illness. I did want to take a quick second to add that this month is indoubt’s fiscal year end. We are a nonprofit and we do rely on you guys’ support to be able to keep providing resources for you that help you connect your faith to life and culture. Things like this weekly podcast, the articles and Bible study that we publish online and our smartphone app wouldn’t be possible without your partnership. If you’d like to help the ministry in any way, you can go to our website and anything that you’re able to give would be greatly appreciated. Thanks again for joining us for this episode of indoubt with Ryan as he talked with Julie. I’d like to encourage you to reach out and connect with us by sending us an email at info@indoubt.ca or you can check us out on social media.
Again, we’d like to thank Julie Kraft for joining us and sharing her journey with bipolar disorder and all the highs and lows that come with it. Check back next week for our next episode with guest, Angela Harrington, where we talk about what being stuck in your situation means and how we can learn to seek God in all of our struggles.

Kourtney Cromwell:
Thanks so much for listening. If you want to hear more, subscribe on iTunes and Spotify or visit us online at indoubt.ca or indoubt.com. We’re also on social media so make sure to follow us on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter.